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And I was thinking to myself, Well the first thing is be modest. It may not be perfect, but it works most of the time very well. Stanley Alpert: Yeah, so everyone talks about how street thugs were afraid of Giulianis cops, and of course theres truth in that. Retrieved January 16, 2023 from Encyclopedia.com: https://www.encyclopedia.com/arts/educational-magazines/alpert-stanley-n-1960. Personal Life. A. G. Edwards - Albert Gallatin Edwards. Stan is currently an environmental and commercial litigator at Constantine Cannon in New York and has thrown himself into the new green business and green building phenomena changing the way America combines economy with environment. Select the best result to find their address, phone number, relatives, and public records. Did you ever relax? In fact, you have to be a little bit modest. There are rare, rare, rare exceptions, but its almost unheard of. He works as an environmental and commercial litigation lawyer in the state of New York. This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google *Sorry, there was a problem signing you up. For questions, comments, and transcripts, please visit our website at goodstory.io or send us an email at podcast@goodstory.io. I think it probably came from my fathers depression era mentality. Stanley N. Alpert served for thirteen years with the U.S. Department of Justice as an Assistant U.S. Attorney for the Eastern District of New York, where he was chief of environmental. And yet there was a sense of fear, they did ask me about my religion and there was a sense of fear in conveying it because there had been some tension in Brooklyn between blacks and Jews. And I, of course, was not trained in how to respond to a kidnapping. My goal was not to prove anything, my goal was not to be a bigger man than them, my goal was to get out of there alive. Refer to each styles convention regarding the best way to format page numbers and retrieval dates. They landed a job as staff writers for LA-based label Keen Records, whose star artist Sam Cooke was then. Alpert, Stanley N. 1960- PERSONAL: Born 1960. He achieved a law degree from the University of Pennsylvania, and completed his Bachelor's degree at the State University at Bingham in New York. By submitting your email, you agree to our Terms and Privacy Policy and to receive email correspondence from us. And then in the months before they were convicted, I was afraid they might have one of their thug friends come try to kill me, so they could prevent the testimony. Including a Jansport for wheelchair users, David Bowie Polaroid film, and Kelly Clarksons popcorn. So you should also find out in which state the lawyers are licensed to practice law, whether they are licensed at Maryland, in which area are they licensed. I think they used some sort of a slang term for it being owned by a Muslim owner. So did his life priorities. Education: State University of New York at Binghamton, B.S. I know thats hard, but for some reason, I cant explain it, my reaction to being at gunpoint was to go into an almost unnatural calm. But if you think of it, once the opportunity is grabbed, well whats the probability? CAREER: Stanley Alpert: Now of course, one needs to have a certain amount of money in order to put a roof over your head, food on the table, and raise your family. Supercharge your marketing by partnering with Trend Hunter. Eventually they calmed down. They held him overnight in. Join our 3,500,000 social media followers, on the cutting edge. Fed So they were trying desperately to intimidate me. Catch up on noteworthy Trend Hunter news and media mentions. Baltimore Law Firms Status: In Good Standing Licensed: 59 years 410-685-1711 Profile LAWPOINTS 22 / 100 LAWPOINTS measure the overall completeness of a Lawyer's profile. Remember, I was kidnapped at night and then this is already the second evening, so that morning in between apparently the thugs had dropped my credit cards on the street and this woman had found them. And they asked me if I wanted something. ; University of Pennsylvania, J.D. ex-wife tells her story of their 10 Things Thatll Almost Definitely Sell Out: From Ncessaire to Hellerware. Stanley Alpert: So there were lots of details. And I thought they might and then finally, a few seconds later, I heard the Lexus pull off, and I ripped off the blindfold. So when we got there, there were three girls who were roughly 16 years old, and each night, Lucky the gang leader, would drive them out to the White Castle on Utica Avenue, where he would sell their goods. Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information. Unclaimed. So I think, live each day to the fullest, realize that whats really important in life is love, and the people around you. A&W Restaurants - Roy Allen and Frank Wright. Police have arrested seven Brooklyn residents, including two teen-age girls, in the robbery and 24-hour kidnapping of a federal prosecutor. Do you wish youd refused to get in the car with them? News SNATCHED OFF STREET. Then when as we drove into Brooklyn, they asked me if Id ever been on the BQE, the Brooklyn-Queens Expressway, to which I said, I had, and you could tell from the length of time spent in the car that we were probably in one of the outer reaches of Brooklyn, perhaps on the border of Queens. Share; Copied! They said, Oops, AUSA, U.S., the FBI is going to be after us. And they viewed that as a genuine risk. A&M Records - Herb Alpert and Jerry Moss. Hector LaSalle was undone by allegations he was more conservative than the governor let on. petco carob chip training treats; orthopedic doctors in carlisle, pa; boston magistrates' court cases this week; duval county court zoom; myasthenia gravis constipation. My guest today is Stanley Alpert, an environmental lawyer, among other positions in his distinguished career, Alpert served for 13 years as a successful federal prosecutor handling environmental cases for the U.S. Department of Justice in the Eastern District of New York. Stanley N. Alpert Schnitzer Steel (recycling) Environmental Counsel | Sustainability | Litigation | Compliance Greater Seattle Area 2K followers 500+ connections Join to connect Schnitzer Steel. Chitra Ragavan: And you were in the car now, and you had a lot of guns pointed at you. The leader of the gang, who went by the street name of Lucky, had a very professional air about him. PERSONAL: 2019Encyclopedia.com | All rights reserved. Personal But in the Actually in the Well, in the days before they were picked up, I was very much afraid that they would come and try to kill me. I mean, who picks up a guy and offers him sexual favors and gives him McDonalds and has this whole, offers him to smoke marijuana. I mean, you had no doubt that these were very dangerous men you were dealing with. I refused to give up. . Chitra Ragavan: So by now, time has passed and theyre friendly while theyre cocking their guns at you, and you know that even that though they are friendly that they could probably kill you, right? Write a review. When it Mattered is a weekly leadership podcast produced by Goodstory, an advisory firm helping technology startups find their narrative. Now I really want to pause here, because I can make light, somewhat, in hindsight of what happened to me, but I dont want to make light of what happened to those girls. You have to stay calm and figure it out. During the same decade, he co-founded A&M Records with Jerry Moss.Alpert has recorded 28 albums that have landed on the Billboard 200 chart, five of which became No. They knew where I lived. Ep. Addresses, Potter, Giselle You kept it in your saving account? Share. Far worse than anything Id experienced in Brooklyn growing up. ', Daniel Kahneman Discusses the Problems with Being Too Brash, Tal Ben-Shahar Examines the Online World's Lack of Privacy, Floyd Abrams Discusses Where Opinion and Voice End Publicly, Kwame Anthony Appiah Discusses Sawying Public Opinion, From Foldable Rolling Tablet Designs to Sleep Breathing Monitors, China Is Taking On The Global Single Malt Whisky Industry, Our Team of Speakers & Virtual Presenters, Terms of Use, Copyright Info & Privacy Policy. Get started today with a free consultation, our self-serve tools, or a dedicated program. Stanley Alpert: This was far more serious. Chitra Ragavan: Stanley Alpert is an environmental lawyer and former Justice Department prosecutor. Stanley Alpert: Well, they were both very dangerous and also very unstable. So, they said, Stanley, what would you be doing right now if we hadnt grabbed you on the street?. Edit your articles and see how they stack up on the leaderboards. Lawyers Edit. I took several writing classes to learn new creative writing skills and then set to long hours of writing, editing, and more editing. Youve got to realize that even though sometimes you are down and out, and man was I down when these guys had my life in their hands and I couldve been killed. Im Chitra Ragavan. But I really had no choice, they had my wallet and it information on what I did for a living so there was no avoiding it. Practices Litigation, Corporate and incorporation, Administrative law. What did they look like, what did they sound like, what information were you able to get in those frenetic first moments? . Fond memories and expressions of sympathy may be shared at . Accommodate the opposition point of view, before you state your own. Save. In 2007 he recorded this experience in the book The Birthday Party: A Memoir of Survival, "an effective, one-two punch of a memoir," as Booklist contributor Connie Fletcher described it. Cabot, Meg 1967-(Meggin Cabot, Patricia Cabot, Jenny Carroll) Chitra Ragavan: Stanley, welcome to the podcast. And so I had fear and concern. Kenya Moore Is More Than a Shade Assassin. But really, they werent that different from me. HomeNew York, NY. Get in touch to learn more, ask a question or submit a tip. And Ive got a lot of friends in the FBI and the NYPD, and I have no fear whatsoever. art is entirely unable to comprehend why anyone would do this . It was a shock and I purposely kept my eyes down toward my knees in the car because I did not want them to think that I was looking at them, so I got only the barest glimpses of them. Stanley Alpert: Yeah, there were two big problems from their point of view with my story. Stanley Alpert is a former federal prosecutor and the author of "The Birthday Party," a memoir about how he survived being kidnapped on his 38th birthday. Stanley Alpert: Well, the first thing is when youre under pressure, stay calm. Education: State University of New York at Binghamton, B.S. But then they dropped you off and you stumbled into a pizza store whose manager didnt want to let you use the phone. Publishers Weekly, November 27, 2006, review of The Birthday Party, p. 44. So it would turn into kidnapping, so this was a very, very serious incident. And we lose sight of the more important points. Stanley N. Alpert has been admitted in 1985, New York; 1987, Florida; 1988, U.S. District Court, Southern and Eastern Districts of New York; 1991, U.S. Court of Appeals, Second Circuit. Potter, Giselle Filter Results. And the funny part is that, the leader of the gang, Lucky, was a highly successful guy out of his criminal life. I was so nice to them that towards the end of it they were asking me for legal advice. But I planned to walk out of there. 2023 Vox Media, LLC. Education:, Leonard, Elmore Company Description: Stanley Alpert is located in Baltimore, MD, United States and is part of the Legal Services Industry. Chitra Ragavan: So now they know you have $110,000 in your savings account, they know you are an attorney to their mind, and their plans have now changed. Reference & Research Book News, May 2007, review of The Birthday Party. Abrams Air Craft - Talbert Abrams. Chitra Ragavan: So this was on cold January night in 1998, and you were walking to your house in Greenwich Village and you were in a really good mood. Just before midnight on January 21, 1998, thenfederal prosecutor Stanley Alpert was forced into a Lexus on 10th Street and Fifth Avenue by three teenagers. They thought I was buying drugs and got rolled, or I was cavorting with prostitutes and got rolled, or I was at a gay party in the West Village and then needed to explain my absence for 25 hours. He spoke well. Stanley Alpert: But all people have to calm down at some point, so they did, and then someone decided to go out to McDonalds and get food. Stanley H Alpert Stanley Alpert (born 1923 . He had met her on the subway, less than an hour. He spoke with Ben Mathis-Lilley. Chitra Ragavan: But by some miracle your gang of three or four, I guess, three mostly, Lucky, Sen and Ren, decided that they were going to the smartest option would be to try and get the last bit of money they could from the ATM machine and let you go and they did. Stanley Alpert: I sure was. And I think what happens with most people is we get caught up in our lives, in our jobs, in our drama at our jobs, in our American Express bills, in yelling at our kids for not doing this, that and the other thing. Chitra Ragavan: Which of course you graciously declined. Discover why 1,151 brands rely on our AI-powered Trend Reports to get better, faster insights. I got a sense of where we were driving because even though I was blindfolded and lying on the backseat of the car, I could hear the hum of the tires going over the metal grating of, I thought it was probably the Brooklyn Bridge, it could have been the Manhattan Bridge or Williamsburg, but most likely the Brooklyn Bridge. I wasnt going to take the sexual favors, I wasnt taking my shoes off, I refused the food at first because I didnt want to be drugged. Kevin McCarthy promised conservatives a vote on their plan to replace federal taxes with a 30 percent national sales tax. Stanley was born November 24, 1927. Chitra Ragavan: And in fact, when they dropped you off they even gave you 20 bucks so you could find your way home. Stanley Alpert: So I was really afraid to tell them who I was, what I was. Attorneys, and I didnt show up and they went into panic mode. Therefore, its best to use Encyclopedia.com citations as a starting point before checking the style against your school or publications requirements and the most-recent information available at these sites: http://www.chicagomanualofstyle.org/tools_citationguide.html. Please contact Stanley Alpert to verify eligibility before booking an appointment. Theyre simply mistaken. And I was treating them as I would any client. stanley alpert wife. Stanley Alpert: So my friends heard these messages, and from their point of view, the greatest likelihood was that I was dead. Of course, it revived itself toward the end, when I thought they were going to shoot me. Verify This Business. Stanley Alpert: I actually received a phone call at one point, I cant identify which one of the perpetrators it was, but he said that he couldnt believe it and he was going to kill me, he was going to kill Lucky, he was going to shoot everybody. Eventually, the following afternoon I did sleep for an hour when things had calmed down, but keep your eye on that and where youre got to push extra beyond youre own abilities, do it. They liked Jewish people, they actually said, this of course was their form of a joke. Share Save. They said that if they had known I was Jewish, they wouldnt have kidnapped me on the street. Contemporary Authors. Within the Cite this article tool, pick a style to see how all available information looks when formatted according to that style. Abbott Laboratories - Wallace Calvin Abbott (1888) Abercrombie & Fitch - David T. Abercrombie and Ezra Fitch. The Stanley Alpert speeches provide viewers with an inside look at the emotional and mental effects Get inspired by 4,000+ keynote speaker videos & our founder, a top keynote speaker on innovation. Contact Us ; When viewing a listing, consider the state advertising restrictions to which lawyers and law firms must adhere, as well as our FindLaw.com Legal Directory disclaimer. I got my box, and she got hers, and she went upstairs to go to her apartment and then I walked up the street going towards mine, and thats when my life changed. Stanley Alpert: Now of course, I know now that dont fool around with those NYPD detectives. And even though I was a federal prosecutor who did not make the most money one can make as a lawyer in New York, I had dutifully saved $110,000. On January 21, 1998, the night before his 38th birthday, federal prosecutor Stanley Alpert was kidnapped by a car full of gun-toting thugs. Just give me my life back. So thats a way to form priorities. Somehow it felt a sense of security just keeping in a savings account and have it available in case of an emergency. And if you think about it, what you do in your life affects those around you. Search our database of 429,629 cutting edge ideas. A podcast on how leaders are forged in critical moments and how they overcome adversity. But at least I got my justice. Browse reviews, directions, phone numbers and more info on Stanley Alpert. Kirkus Reviews, November 1, 2006, review of The Birthday Party, p. 1107. New York Times, January 24, 2007, William Grimes, "A Hostage Who Stayed a Few Steps Ahead," review of The Birthday Party. Alpert Stanley. If he did, however, he would have evidence to track the gang, for he made careful observations during his captivity. Address. Alpert served for 13 years as a federal prosecutor for the U.S. Department of Justice in the Eastern District of New York. So I noticed the pattern on the tiles, it was a typical tenement building. I survived. And I kept firmly focused on that. Southern District of Florida, Miami, law clerk for United States district judge Edward B. Davis; Kaye Scholer, LLP, New York, NY, commercial litigator; United States Department of Justice, assistant United States attorney for the Eastern District of New York and chief of environmental litigation; Weitz & Luxenberg, New York, NY, head of the Environmental Toxic Tort Unit; The Alpert Firm, New York, NY, founder, director. Writer, beginning 1960s. There, Alpert investigated, prosecuted, or supervised many complex civil and criminal cases, some resulting in multimillion-dollar awards. The NYPD was contacted, the FBI was brought in, and there was a massive, massive investigation that was launched for you. Stanley Alpert is an excellent trial attorney with over 40 years of experience. He says, Come on, what kind of kidnapping was this? They pushed me into the street into a car, and shut me in the car. But now theyre looking at $110,000 and you cant take out more than a thousand at a time, so they saw this as their lucky day and they had caught a fish that they wanted to take home. . He anchored and also reported sports news at WBIS-TV, WTVR-TV, as well as WHSV-TV. Location. Im a Jew, we dont eat ham, and a ham and cheese is just unthinkable to me. That scheme evolved over the night, they were afraid theyd get caught, it didnt look right for that to happen in their minds. See More Stories. These are tremendous lessons. Get the latest business insights from Dun & Bradstreet. Chitra Ragavan: But this was different. The leader of the gang left, I was being held by the landlord and the girls. Abt Sportsline - Johann Abt. Then as I mentioned earlier, even though youre being accommodating, you have to stay firm where its necessary. Stanley Alpert: And I said, Actually, this evening is going to be my birthday, I was going to take some friends to concert. And they thought that was the funniest thing they ever heard. And then they had these prostitutes there, and it turned out that the proprietors of the prostitution establishment were able to sample the goods, and thats what they did. Nathan Alpert: Birthdate: estimated between 1877 and 1933 : Death: Immediate Family: Son of Aaron Alpert and Sarah Alpert Husband of Janet Alpert Father of Aaron Alpert and Stanley Alpert Brother of Hyman Alpert; Gertrude (Gishie) Green; Pearl Gans; Sophie Kramer and Anna Weinberg. So in a way, the ordeal did come to an end. Stanley Alpert: There were certain lines that I drew that I wouldnt allow them to cross, but mostly I was very friendly, very cooperative, really quite an amiable guy. Stanley Alpert is Commercial Litigation attorney from Baltimore, MD. Are you ever afraid that they will remember you and try to come at you? Entertainment Weekly, January 26, 2007, Vanessa Juarez, review of The Birthday Party, p. 75. So I always did that. New York Times Book Review contributor Mick Sussman noted that Alpert "wins over the reader the same way he did the kidnappers, with the force of his canny, self-assured, bighearted personality. Youre Jewish and your captors were African-American and this was a very tough time for race relations in New York City. Oh my God, We kidnapped the blankety-blankety-blanker on his birthday, and then they decided to offer me the services of the young women as a present for my birthday. Join 329,138 subscribers who rely on our weekly newsletter to keep up with need-to-know trends and insights. Apply state Stanley Alpert: So I think whats happened since, is Ive learned to live each day as though it were my last. The Best Gifts for Chefs, According to Chefs and Restaurant Owners. In addition to the MLA, Chicago, and APA styles, your school, university, publication, or institution may have its own requirements for citations. Similar praise came from a Publishers Weekly reviewer who termed The Birthday Party "an honest, vivid chronicle." Get counterintuitive, surprising, and impactful stories delivered to your inbox every Thursday. environmental lawyer & state prosecutor stanley alpert recounts his [scary, but sometimes hilarious] experience of being kidnapped in new york city. Search instead in Creative? So Ive got a whole set of Stans Life, Adversity, and Management Principles, if youre interested in hearing them. Stanley Alpert: And I think the last thing I would say is that life as well as work, relationships, theyre all a marathon. 1 on the U . If theyd sliced me on the arm with a knife, if theyd shot the bullet next to my ear, if they hadnt released me unharmed, if the FBI and the NYPD hadnt rounded them up, I might be scarred in a very different way. The 18 Best Makeup Removers for All Types of Skin, Songwriters Hall of Fame to Party With Gloria Estefan, Sade, Snoop Dogg. Edward R. Pressman, Indie Producer Behind. Chitra Ragavan: So the plans must have changed at that point as to what to do with you? And of course, when youre stuck in the middle of crime, that instinct gets even stronger. Duration. Stay calm under pressure, its the only way youre going to survive. Stan Alpert and Gregg Kaufman moved along with two client associates, and had generated $3.9 million in annual revenue at Morgan Stanley, according to a Wells spokeswoman. Stanley Alpert relies on his hearing when he is kidnapped. Id only seen the wrong end of a knife a couple of times in Brooklyn, usually it was the wrong end of someones fist. He ended up blindfolded in a Brooklyn apartment as his captors changed their plans, alternately threatening him and his family . Are you more probable to be caught and be put in prison? Get inspired with our 4,152 innovation strategy articles, keynote, videos and innovation tools. They feared that. Uncover major shifts and emerging opportunities with our exclusive PRO research. Chitra Ragavan: One last question, that is; theyre now back out of prison. Of course PTSD, post-traumatic stress disorder is a major thing and I get it, and I could have been sent there if the circumstances of what had happened to me had been a little bit different. They kept pointing their guns at me and cocking them at me, and clicking the trigger without there being a bullet in the chamber. Served as a federal environmental prosecutor in New York for 13 years. The two thugs, Ren and Sen, were the heat for the prostitution operation. "Alpert, Stanley N. 1960- I hadnt eaten the night before but by about 1:00 PM, of the day that I was there, they asked me whether I would like some food and they were going to the neighborhood deli. Chitra Ragavan: So as the night passed on the other side, your colleagues were very worried, started looking for you, your friends were frantic. Education: Cooper Union Sc, Personal It is my hope that this true-to-life, near-death experience will inspire people to live life to the fullest, whether that be by writing or doing something else that fulfills.". Join 329,138 entrepreneurs, innovators and CEOs who rely on our weekly trend report to stay ahead of the crowd. And because of it I understand that this day could be my last. Learn how Trend Hunter harnesses the power of artificial intelligence. Stanley Alpert: I was absolutely terrified. It was Stanley Alpert's birthday on Jan. 21, 1998, and he was carrying a Advertisement. Just before midnight on January 21, 1998, then-federal prosecutor Stanley Alpert was forced into a Lexus on 10th Street and Fifth Avenue by three teenagers. Stanley Alpert's office is located at 23 Robert Pitt Drive, Suite 110, Monsey, NY 10952. Stanley Alpert: I appreciate that you had me on, Chitra. Each of us is formed by the environment into which we are brought into, which we are raised. A conversation with the writer and kidnapping survivor. The next day, they released him. But they did bring me back a Snapple, and when they gave it to me, I could hear the click of opening it so that I knew that it hadnt been drugged. The next day, I had a turkey sandwich that they bought. Stanley Alpert, who is head of civil environmental . Stanley N. Alpert served for thirteen years with the U.S. Department of Justice as an Assistant U.S. Attorney for the Eastern District of New York, where he was chief of environmental litigation. Phone (410) 685-1711 ; Fax (410) 685-1771 ; Email. They had sex with the girls, they smoked pot. Does Stanley Alpert accept Medicare? All I find I keep, meaning if you claim to not have money, they would go through your pockets and grab whatever you had. The Birthday Party A Memoir Of Survival Stanley N Alpert then it is not directly done, you could bow to even more roughly this life, approaching the world. And the environment into which I was raised, which I didnt choose for myself, was one in which, when you walked the street you could expect that there would be other young men, a little bit older than you, whod come up and demand your money, ask you, Lend me a dime, Stanley, was the big line. The gift is everyday we wake up, we breathe, and we have opportunities to go out in the sunshine, to take a walk in a park, to hug somebody we love. I was really a saver in those days. Why didnt the investigators believe youd really been abducted at first? So that was the cast of characters, plus there was a final male individual who was the landlord, he owned the apartment and he would rent out the space in it, that they could use for their evening crash pad to run first their prostitution ring and then their robberies. Contemporary Authors. Education: Academy of Applied Arts (Prague, Czechoslovakia), M.A., 1974; attended Royal College of Art (London, England), 1977-78. ." And you could see the instability of all of these characters from the start. Finally, however, he was able to supply the police with enough information to lead them to the gang. And they had only recently switched into this business of picking up suckers on the street who they could steal from their cash machine cards. Bring the Future Festival experience directly to your team or co-hosted custom event. Because each style has its own formatting nuances that evolve over time and not all information is available for every reference entry or article, Encyclopedia.com cannot guarantee each citation it generates. Edit your profile, connect your social media accounts, and more. Stanley Alpert: In fact, Lucky the gang leader, just before he was about to take me back and he was just going to drop off the prostitutes at the White Castle on Utica Avenue, and he stops before he leaves the apartment and he turns around, he says, Stanley, let me ask you something. Then they went and they got the Super of my building to break into my apartment and they played my answering machine. Stanley Alpert: Next thing for me is always keep your eyes on the goal. However, the date of retrieval is often important. They decided to become criminals, I decided to work my tail off, get my education and move forward. But as soon as they heard that as soon as they realized that I was a federal prosecutor, which happened when they asked me again in the middle of the night. Using clues he had memorized while captive, Alpert then lead FBI and NYPD agents to his kidnappers within mere hours. Wed gone and found some chocolate chip cookies. Writer, lawyer. New York Times, January 25, 1998, "Kidnappers Rob Then Release a Prosecutor.". Build a portfolio and put your trend-spotting abilities to the test. He also explains how he survived the. He was lucky to released but not before his captors got his ATM password and withdrew large sums of cash from several banks. So thank you to Lucky, Ren, Sen, Ramos and the poor abused prostitute girls for helping me meet my wife. And what you dont realize when you push forward and get your education and got to law school and move forward. I just met a young woman on the train. And you know, you cant change a person. But another very formative experience is both being lawyer but also more importantly, being a federal prosecutor. Even though I was blindfolded if you release me, are you more likely to get caught or would it better to put a bullet in my head and throw me in a garbage dumpster somewhere?

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